XS1100 AUSTRALIA
XS1100 Topics => Workshop => Topic started by: Jonesy :-) on December 07, 2014, 09:37:06 PM
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this is from the ute load of spare I got a while back, After seeing how thin on the ground these tanks are becoming I thought I'd have a crack at bring this one back to life, I reckon I can make it functional but beautiful might be a real challenge. I picked the worst of the 3 to do up but wasnt expecting it to be this bad
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how where you planning to bring it back, via bog and sanding or actually welding nuts to the dents and using a slide hammer,
could also do with a bath in CLR or the such, that would be at the end of course
it,s certainly a challenge you,ve set for ones self
I,ll be watching,, have a couple of sad cases here too
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its going to take a few different methods
slide hammer
welding in new metal sections
possibly pressurizing with compressed air then heating with oxy to pop out some sections
and definitely some bog.
still working on getting back to bare metal for full picture of damage
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I tried and do not reccommend the pump air in to pressurise and pop out the dings. Mine just popped completely out of shape so much so that it wouldn't fit on the frame :o :o :o.
just sayin ;D.
Eddy
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how much pressure Eddy?
did you use oxy to heat and soften ding or just try popping out cold?
I've had some success with exhaust system off a chook chaser
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here's one, 78'E macho maroon, and i thought IT was effing rough... if worth salvaging best splash out on a por15 tank sealer kit, kills ALL rust DEAD, then roll the treacle-like sealer around inside to coat everything, end sealed result is primo, cures rock hard, leaves a tough-as metallic coating inside. ps, got no key, anyone got any hints on getting the lid off without one?
(https://xs1100.com.au/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhomepages.slingshot.co.nz%2F%7Epatrickk%2Fp449.jpg&hash=3b459c99885a1bbf860b2534f947b059f4dc6ba7)
(https://xs1100.com.au/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhomepages.slingshot.co.nz%2F%7Epatrickk%2Fp448.jpg&hash=a32ff61c7ada2996482372bddc518ab600909ede)
(https://xs1100.com.au/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhomepages.slingshot.co.nz%2F%7Epatrickk%2Fp447.jpg&hash=e7b18a90c67b387498d0b6be05b4e7af09c98b12)
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prob not what you want to hear mate - but a flat blade screwdriver in the keyhole and a shifter works a treat.....
bye bye lock tho
:(
on a brighter note, that POR15 treatment is the absolute best!
:D
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May I suggest a little more finess than Bryans "screwdriver option". :-\ ??? :o
I had a similar dilemma.....took it to a locksmith and all he needed was the 4 numbers as shown beside the insert for the key.
Cost next to nothing and got a working key as well. :P
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cool, will give em' 3948 and see what they come up with, still picking you can pop those lids undamaged with flexy wire or something
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I believe the 4 digit number refers to the type of blank for the key . The locksmith I took mine to had no issues opening the lock and cutting a key whatsoever.
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What do you reckon the welds on the inside are about, mine has some of that going on as well?
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previous owner opened it up to do some panel beating from the inside to knock dents out then sewed it back up again
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Ah ok thanks be interesting to see how much bog is under the paint.
Hope you don't mind I join up with your thread and I will document as I go as well.
I probably should have cleaned it down and leak tested it first but clearing out the remanence of the fuel after draining is the fun part :)
Oh what colour canned paint should I go, still can't decide. I like Orange it is the safest colour but Bryans got that :P
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Well now I am confused and feel a bit stupider than usual?
My leak test found nothing?
Some time back I removed the overflow pipe when it got in the way of the racing seat I was fabricating. One of my first thoughts with this leak was I had gotten some over flow and it had dripped down under the tank. I spent several hours cleaning and re cleaning the area to see where it was coming from and I was sure it was originating from under the rear mount.
Anyway I will document my pressure test in case it is some help to others.
I made up this to seal the filler neck. I had two steel washers so I used 3 rubber washers. one for bolt to washer then washer to washer then washer to tank. Tacked a nut to some Flat bar. After some adjustment on the size I was able to bolt this all together thyen slip the flat bar into the tank.
You don't need a complete seal just good enough that the tank will hold a little pressure.
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Then I connected a bike pump to the petcock. You will need to set the petcock to prime or similar so the air will flow straight in. Once I got some pressure I turned the petcock to the "modified" Off position. You may need to come up with another idea if you haven't done this mod. Maybe on and reserve will also work, not sure?
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Then spray the tank with a mix of detergent and water, try not to suds it up too much. Here you can see the filler seal. This picture gives a great example of how a leak will show up, pretty hard to miss. You could just use the tank door I spose but then the filler neck is not being checked for leaks as well. Be nothing worse than a freshly painted tank that needs repairs.
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But no matter how many times I tried I could not find a leak in the tank???
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Now I have gotten motivated Guess I might as well keep going and take it back to metal.
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My turn.....
so all the paint and bog has been removed........this tank has had some major damage and repairs in another life
the right side that was previously opened up and repaired from inside.
Providing it doesnt leak, I'll probably leave this as is and use minimal bog, it previously had a layer about 3-4mm thick
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and the left side
note 2 brazing repair jobs to the left and below the big circle. the circle is to be cutout due to several pin holes and generally rusted out
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some time later with the rust removed,
might be extreme but it gives you a good inspection window
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And the offending piece with pinholes
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Glad I saved this old BBQ lid while the rest went to the dump, its about the same gauge steel and a perfect donor for a patch piece(s)
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Next is to clean up the 5 cent size rust hole at the rear right back to good parent metal for a patch
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Hey Mudsy....love ya work bra.....I have a question if I may ?
When welding the circular insert ......to prevent the weld staying proud of the finished surface.......would you slightly turn in both mating surfaces to recess the weld and minimise bog ?
Whats your plan on that ?
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simple butt weld and grind/sand back flush....that's the easy bit.
getting the curved profile to match the tank is the challenging part
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I thought that's why they invented "Body Filler".
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Easy for you maybe ;D .............I d end up with a series of blow holes .........which in area of measurement ...........would end up being roughly the same in total as the large hole I would be tryin to fix. :'( ::) >:(
What type of weld would you use?
TIG ? MIG? GAS ? GASLESS? BRAZE?
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oxy-acetylene No:6 tip
no doubt I'll use some body filler but thats too easy, I'm gunna try as best I can to get some profile into the patch
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am loving the story Paul, how on earth did you cut a perfect hole so clean in a multi shaped surface?
am in awe of you and Bretts and the way your metal work turns out,
would kill for a gas axe kit, but its something I can,t justify with the amount of work it would do
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Thanks mate,
It really aint that perfect, just cut it free hand with a dremel and mini cutting discs.
Still over in WA crushing rocks but will resume the project when I get back, but that wont be until new years day
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Enjoying it too Jonesy, nice start. Looking forward to the finished product. Seems mine did have a pin hole FFS I have no idea why it didn't show up in the leak test ::)
I only have the mig so just turned down low and zapped it. Since I don't trust my leak detection any more I am putting it back on the bike and will put a tank of petrol through it to make sure all is good before I paint :-X
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Hey Brett,
where was your pinhole? I woulda thought your test would work, I was going to test in a similar way for mine.
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On the bottom edge towards the front, then another two right next to the fuel tap.
Have no idea why test didn't work, I thought it had heaps of pressure and showed the leak coming out from the washer so buggerd if I know????
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Made a little progress by getting a patch ready for welding in, but thought I'd use the hole I cut for access to de-rust the inside of the tank.
I was going to do it by hand with abrasive but some of the nooks n crannies are still inaccessible for getting right in there.
So I thought why not give Steptoes latest vid a trial run.
(https://xs1100.com.au/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimagizer.imageshack.us%2Fv2%2F800x600q90%2F537%2F8x4BXX.jpg&hash=f534b00340f75f1f5b38ca6f6ecf649cfe57aec2)
This 1000Ltr tank might be big enough to take a whole frame?
(https://xs1100.com.au/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimagizer.imageshack.us%2Fv2%2F800x600q90%2F913%2F1gYpqL.jpg&hash=87128110e7956e57873a5b36c3a1bbc9976b25b5)
Thanks for the tip steptoe
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thats cool Jonesy, I did end up with the earth on the tank and power on the probe, moved a lot more in a shorter time span I felt, and with you not worrying about paint
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Well, the tank went in looking like this
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and 24hrs later, 18 with the +ive on the tank an 6 with -ive on, (after steptoes last comment)
next to the tank is a piece of copper pipe I used for the electrode.
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on the tank is a rusty/coppery looking residue that remained after water blasting. I'm not sure if its displaced rust or copper elecroplating from the electrode?
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as an after thought I probably should of said {on the vid also} that I used a piece of gal 8 gauge steel wire, that,s the first thing I laid my hands on
sorry maybe my bad
even with the yellowy coating, it certainly looks a lot cleaner
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Got a bit more done today
all tacked in
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welded in and ready for pressure testing..........I've already sussed a pinhole to be plugged before I test
If the soapy water doesnt show anything I'll chuck it in the de-rusting tank, and see if their are any air bubbles, just like looking for a puncture
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looking good jonesy
good to see the inside of a tank gave me a few ideas
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back to the
drawing board hole saw. this smaller circle bit is just too riddled with pinholes that PO had brazed up, so its going to be easier to do another patch, the big patch had a couple of little pinholes that the soapy water revealed and now sorted.
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A panel beater once showed me a 50 s car he was restoring .....was so riddled with holes he estimated he had added another 40 kgs of weight to it in welding rods, :o
Love ya work bra.
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all the patching and pressure testing done, now for por 15 treatment for the inside of the tank
(https://xs1100.com.au/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimagizer.imageshack.us%2Fv2%2F800x600q90%2F673%2Fh60Z8z.jpg&hash=4c3a6c21db214b04ada7d273a646f7cc567f0525)
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I decided a while ago this tank wasnt going to be pretty (not enough time), but it will be functional. got all new rubber bits for it too
fuel cap, tap to tank gaskets and fuel sender
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Well done, Por15 tank sealing kits are just great, no need to worry about the insides ever again.. :)
Looking forward to end result.
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:( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :(
well the 24 litre challenge beat me.
the more pinholes I chased in the PO's repairs the more they opened up to the point where I decided it wasnt worth it.
upside is I have a complete set of seals for a fuel tank, a POR 15 tank sealing kit and a shiny new letterbox ::)
or as mrs jonesy suggested. the makings of a perpetual trophy?...........gunna be awkward to transport back n forth to rallies for handover etc but
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And the moral of this story is..... :-\
"Don t count ya pin holes before ya patch " ;D
otherwise.......... we would never have been entertained by this saga ;)
luv ya tenacity though bra .
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Jonesy my R100S could use that tank resealer stuff. Bring it to the rally and I'll take it off your hands for what you paid for it less senior citizens discount of course. Do you need to see my Centrelink Old People's card.
Saw on the back of my 73 year old mates side car "SPONSORED BY CENTRELINK"
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Bugger Jonesy, I think I have mine now but still not 100% sure, will need the tank sealer at some stage, no rush though, how much did you pay and where did you get it?
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I can't find the picture of it now Jonesy but I tried to increase the size of a BMW tank by brazing bits in.
Unfortunately as the Bronze filler rod cooled it contracted ripping the tank near each joint. It's not as easy as it would first appear.
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I only had a few pin holes and I chased my tail for a while. Only had the mig to use. I don't know which welding type would actually work best, maybe tig. it seals well and the amount of heat can be very manageable. I want a tig :)
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I have oxy and arc (stick). I reckon I could make a fist of it if I fusion welded it instead of brazing it. The tank has to be in fair condition in the first place though. Sound like yours was too far gone. :-[ :-[ :-[
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I havent turned it into a letterbox just yet, doing the fifo thing limits what you can get done while at home, so it was consuming valuable time, which in hindsight is why I wrote it off prematurely. its back on the burner at the moment, but it wont be going to wellington which i was trying to rush to do before
theres a couple of things I realised doing this job.
1) soapy water isnt as good a leak detector as filling the tank with water and then putting about 10psi of air up its Ask ya mother' to really see where the leaks are. this thing was like the fountain at kings cross with water streaming from all sorts of places.
sorry scarfey and brett I've already used the first 2 products of the 3 step POR 15 procedure, oh yeah $85 at the local auto paint specialist shop, I did get a quote of $115 from a bike shop, none of the usual supects like super cheap, auto one or repco carry it
2)the rust converter step really opens up any bits that were hanging together by rust
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Oh goody goody.... ;D more adventures and more to learn :P
Like i said.....luv ya tenacity bra :)
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To throw a cat amongst the pigeons ......in the case of "pinholes"...... have any of you Einsteins considered silver soldering ?
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Bought six pissy little sticks of 45% silver solder the other day. Cost a shade under $100. But a good idea Stepping Toe.
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For the uninitiated blunderers who have never silver soldered before.........it s all in the preparation...and flux....combined with the right amount of heat .
No Steppers here you old bugger Scarf ;D
But I make allowances for centerlink pensioners ;D :P